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But you’re still limited by the designer of that shell? Or userspace? Or kernel? Or cpu architecture? I mean, how deep should you go before «it’s however YOU want»?

There are some really powerful UIs that are extremely flexible, like spreadsheets, or ComfyUI, or certain issue trackers. On the whole however I would say they all still are mostly their own interaction silos and integrations with other programs have to be explicitly built for each app.

The great thing about a shell is that you can glue together programs that don't know about each other. This is not a silver bullet, with shell programs being text oriented etc., but it does give rise to some powerful possibilities that don't really work with UIs.


This is the exact problem with the Unix greybeards smug nature: no matter how low level you go you are always on top of some abstractions.

Criticising people just because they don't use your choice of tools is just elitism and leaves a bad taste.

If someone uses a GUI to accomplish their goals that should be complimented not criticised.


This isn’t true. You can buy oil with other currencies. It’s just that dollars are liquid. No pun intended.


That’s because those who (our countries that enforce it) eat less, have smaller properties, less productive cars and infrastructure etc, those are the countries that will have the short end of the stick in 10-20 years time - just look at Europe. The tragedy of the commons at a global scale.


> less productive cars

How does enforcing emissions regulations result in less productive cars?

Cars move about 1.5 people per trip on average. A big pickup or SUV is not any more productive doing this task than a mid sized car.


You are worse, sorry to be harsh. It would be better for your kids (and yourself) if you locked yourself away for a set time to TikTok on your phone 100%, and them after you put your phone away and you are 100% with your kids.


Thanks for this. I wish it was an easy way to market this info to the wider non technical audience. It is a huge selling point for GOS that is difficult to package and make attractive (because it is difficult to understand / care about).


Well… you can run android without google? The problem is that essential security services require apple or google devices and you as a member of society need the security services.


> Well… you can run android without google?

You can only run LineageOS on smartphones that allow unlocking the bootloader (which is more and more rare), and properly release the kernel source-code (many still don't, especially low-end MTK-based phones...)


You can run GrapheneOS on Pixel phones, and soon Motorola :-).


Let's call them anti-competition services since there's nothing in these increasing security.


Yet on LineageOS you're not affected. It seems you can build Android that isn't affected by Google, at least if you're willing to personally adjust the code to do what you want. You'd have to get exceptionally busy before it's not recognisable as an Android distribution anymore


How’s LineageOS compatibility these days? And besides F-droid, is there a place where mobile apps are plentiful without being full of malware?

Also, how’s isolation on LineageOS for mobile apps? I think I’m getting to the point where I’m thinking of ditching Apple again


> I think I’m getting to the point where I’m thinking of ditching Apple again

I would wholeheartedly recommend going for a Pixel with GrapheneOS. I have been an /e/OS user on a Fairphone for 5 years before reading a lot about GrapheneOS and switching to GrapheneOS. It's honestly so much better!

If you go from iPhone to GrapheneOS, you get better security. If you go from iPhone to anything else, you get worse (to extremely worse) security.


Aurora 'Store' is a client for Google Play that lets you filter on apps without ads or in-app purchases. My experience is that that's be a decent proxy for "don't show me all the bullshit".

It's also a good proxy for "no results" but then at least you know there is no free app that does what you want just yet :)

Anyway that's what I use to get the proprietary government and other societally required apps, and while I'm not on Lineage right now, it's meant to work there


So true.

Maybe a case for the EU? I mean, they like creating laws limiting the power of big tech. Maybe there should be a law that requires all services that are used by public institutions and commercial transaction providers to be transparent to the public and therefore open source. And as a platform provider, they should be required to offer APIs to let users install alternative implementations.

Might require some fine-tuning, but you get the idea.


You are right. I feel much safer now! /s I really need to look into those other versions of Android or even Huawei. I have a feeling they might not quite work in Canada. Part of the reason I am incensed about this, is that right now there are all sorts of measures globally, under the guise of safety, that seem to be about something completely different.


Would this not require some control over the hardware? Which would be difficult for the FOSS community?


maybe not, heck people reverse engineered apple hardware and implemented it in various FOSS driver stacks

But yeah, vendors maintaining their drivers upstream in FOSS projects would obviously make it easer


I tried. But then I didnt get access to essential services like banking and national resources.


FWIW, I submitted an EU DMA complaint (Art 27 report) against Alphabet for unfair gatekeeping against third-party distributions like GrapheneOS via Play Integrity. More info: https://github.com/AlexAltea/blog/blob/master/posts/2026-06-...

Convincing developers, especially bank and gov apps, is near impossible and won't scale well. Going after Alphabet for not meeting DMA obligations seems the easier path. Might not go anywhere but worth a shot.


> Convincing developers, especially bank and gov apps, is near impossible and won't scale well

Not impossible though, my bank and govt eID app did do safetynet, but after enough users complained in both apps you can now skip a warning and use it without issues


The government and bank in question deserve to be named and praised.


Austrian eID app (ID Austria) + Erste Bank/Sparkasse AG (George Austria)

AFAIK they make use of this: https://a-sit-plus.github.io/warden-supreme/integration/supr...


Is there something we can do to support your efforts?


Only two things come to mind:

1. Provide or find pro bono legal resources deeply familiar with EU DMA and similar antitrust regulations, willing to proof-check and improve this report, and perhaps advise on better channels to submit it.

2. Locate more affected end-users, including applicable members of the GrapheneOS Foundation and developers behind other distributions, make them aware of these efforts so that hopefully we submit a joint complaint. (Might get more traction, though AFAICT reporting is limited to EU citizens).

Happy to fork this into its own repository if it helps with collaboration.


1. I will look into that.

A heads-up: the FSFE has already submitted a case for device neutrality regarding both, the ability to completely uninstall AI features and the unlimited interoperability decoupled from ADV: https://fsfe.org/news/2026/news-20260615-01.en.html

“Interoperability must be decoupled from developer verification procedures. We need clear, precise, and inclusive rules to prevent circumvention by gatekeepers and to ensure that interoperability becomes a concrete reality in practice” states Lucas Lasota, FSFE Legal Programme Manager


I can tell you it has NOTHING to do with developer, but more the business/content protection people say unlocked bootloader is not secured.


GrapheneOS runs with a locked bootloader. You temporarily unlock during installation but after re-locking, boot integrity can be validated against GrapheneOS' verified-boot keys. See: https://grapheneos.org/articles/attestation-compatibility-gu...


Graphene OS user here. Almost all of the apps I tried work fine. All the banking apps I use work. Have you tried reaching out to the app developer or the service and explaining what Graphene OS is and asking them to support it? I was able to persuade one app to do it.

[1] https://privsec.dev/posts/android/banking-applications-compa...


Problem is that all banks require a national centrale controlled service for login (BankID in Norway). And it is this service that I cannot get to work running GrapheneOS. It worked a couple of months ago, but not anymore. And all customer services and complaints are directed to your bank who 1) has no idea what i am talking about and 2) no control over BankID verification requirements.


I’ve nearly decided to switch back to the code brick instead of BankID app. It’s less convenient, but with the way things are going, I’m just not sure I want to exist in the digital world much longer.


Good idea. Maybe it wouldn’t be too bad to just attach the code brick to my keyring anyways.


I switched to GrapheneOS a couple months ago, and the only real downside is that MitID (danish verison of BankID) doesn't work. I got the code brick and attached it to my keyring and it's honestly not that bad, I usually have the keys close by anyway. Also most apps that need MitID allow you to create a pin to log in without reverification once you've logged in once.


99% of websites won't work with that one.

source: I eventually got bankid on the phone in late 2025


I did actually alert BankID about this potential lock-in issue back when they announced they would be abandoning the SIM-based (and thus phone-independent) solution, to little understanding and just general comments about the cost of keeping the SIM-based solution alive. I guess now with eSIM being prevalent it wouldn't have made much difference anyway.

But just the thought of the potential to be completely locked out of everything from banks to online payments, logins to the public health system, tax filings (and basically all public sector services) just at the whim of Google or Apple's automated algorithms misunderstanding some random account activity, is a thought that should make everyone (and especially those in countries dependent on systems like BankID) afraid and demand at minimum:

Rights to:

- Due Process

- Accountability from Google & Apple and fines for when they do wrong

- Multiple warnings (with a right to know what you're being accused of) before being locked out

- Well-functioning complaint procedures with strict time frames

- Make the mere concept of banning users "for life" illegal

...from Google and Apple (and strict fines for them not adhering to them). Feel free to add more to the list.

Else we as a society can't depend on a smartphone as the main key to our lives anymore.


Raise the issue with both the consumer protection watchdog and the trade watchdog. This is a monopoly issue that's impacting consumer choice.


Correction: i did get bank access. I just couldnt log into the bank without a google or apple controlled device.


lol, this problem stopped me from installing GrapheneOS early. But now.. I removed banking apps by myself because my state require room them to collect phone fingerprint and access to location EACH time they opened. So... looks like now nothing stops me


Impossible?


I would consider many scenarios impossible. How do you proceed when 2 bishops are on the same diagonal protecting each other? That was what I got after capturing the initial horse.


It is possible, just saying that I can't do it, and there's no logic behind it.

You just have to be lucky and stumble upon a sequence that allows you to surive.

The RNG is seeeded though, always same seed, so you can determinarically explore all moves and find some sequences that lead to higher scores.


Pseudoproductive jobs consisting of stuff like replying to irrelevant emails, filling out unnecessary paperwork, writing reports no one will ever read. Coincidentally, people on these jobs often sees the biggest upside with AI.


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